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PostSubject: A couple of Kahlerized basses on eBay   Sat Oct 16, 2010 1:12 pm


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PostSubject: Re: A couple of Kahlerized basses on eBay   Sat Oct 16, 2010 1:37 pm

isnt that the same thing CB has just with emg's?
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PostSubject: Re: A couple of Kahlerized basses on eBay   Sat Oct 16, 2010 3:09 pm

DAMN IT....that's exactly what I want!!!! If only the shop/I hadn't messed it all up.... Mad

I paid EXACTLY that much for mine--STOCK! Then I bled $150 for a trem, over $200 for the fudged Kahler installation, and like $150 for pickups, electronics, and other junk, and it's farther from being playable than it's ever been.

That thing is GOLD, I tell ya! Someone here please buy it...
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PostSubject: Re: A couple of Kahlerized basses on eBay   Sat Oct 16, 2010 10:21 pm

omg $2500 for a bc rich??? i mean, its nice ... but $2500!?!?!?!?

the hamer is nice. the redone paint looks good. i wudda rather bought it and refinished it myself.

CB ... what happened with your fudged installation? what did they get wrong? did you get any compensation?
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PostSubject: Re: A couple of Kahlerized basses on eBay   Sun Oct 17, 2010 8:31 am

madmike wrote:
omg $2500 for a bc rich??? i mean, its nice ... but $2500!?!?!?!?

the hamer is nice. the redone paint looks good. i wudda rather bought it and refinished it myself.

CB ... what happened with your fudged installation? what did they get wrong? did you get any compensation?

Hah!

Well, it was installed slightly crooked and it wasn't recessed. When I picked it up, I was shown how it was installed and I had no choice but to accept it because I couldn't afford to give it back to them to recess it. I didn't realize it wasn't straight until months later and I guess that if I complained, they'd have the same response--"we'll fix it if you pay us."
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PostSubject: Re: A couple of Kahlerized basses on eBay   Sun Oct 17, 2010 10:03 am

but they still expect you to pay them for the crap work they did ... or what? ... they keep your bass?

i hate people. not just these so called "luthiers" ... most people are just half butt and lazy. its refreshing when somone actually does do a good job.

similar experience ........

guild LS II ... irreplaceable vintage bass. the set neck was off (badly) and needed to be reset.

it took 4 months for them to do the work.

before, the action was 1/2" above the 12th fret. after ... it was 1/8" closer ... and they called this fixed and tried to tell me that it plays great now ... and thattl be $350. it played like poo.

i told them thats a ridiculous price and its not fixed correctly. i will pay $350 but only if they do it again and get the action correct this time. they said iddid be another $200 to do it again (and who knows what ittl be like then). i told them i'm not giving them a dime ... so they kept my bass.

what was i supposed to do? call the cops? beat them up?

they have been posting the bass on CL regularly for $800 for about 4 years now.

sorry to be a bummer on this thread, but this is a pet peeve of mine.

luthiers = butchers = hacks
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PostSubject: Re: A couple of Kahlerized basses on eBay   Sun Oct 17, 2010 8:25 pm

OK...I would like to amend my statements. I have seen some fine work come from Mike Lull's lutherie. The problem with my Hamer project is ME. I didn't have the clarity, understanding, planning, preparation, or anything to see it though. I wanted everything at once and what came of it is nothing at all. A wonderful instrument turned into pieces. Mike Lull and his boys do incredible work, it was my inability to deal with the situation with a level head and stand up for myself that lead me down this path. Well, I'm learning a lesson and I've got a better chance than ever to get this project to work out well. Now that I can't play for a little while, I finally have the patience to gather the necessary supplies (really just money to get someone to recess the trem haha) and make solid preparations so I can have the instrument I've dreamt of.

Hey, in fact, I know firsthand how nice the work from ML's shop is--they replaced the bridge on my mom's acoustic and it's fantastic. It's an Ibanez copy of a Martin Dreadnought from the mid 80s. It's an OK guitar, but she's gotten over the years a new bone nut, a bone bridge, an ebony tailpiece, and a Fishman pickup installed. I recommended D'Addario EXP coated bronze strings and it's a joy to play now. Neck's a little thin for my taste and it has a darker sound, but plenty loud with the D'Addarios.
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PostSubject: Re: A couple of Kahlerized basses on eBay   Mon Oct 18, 2010 5:12 am

mike lulls shop does have a good reputation ... nationwide.

i understand the impatient thing. when i am impatient, it never seems to go well. i do better with it when i'm doing the work myself.

i dont care who they are. i still dont think that someone letting something inferior leave their shop is acceptable. i think that when it comes to trems ... bassists dont get taken seriously ... and i think a lot just give you something so that you'll just go away. when they are gone, they make justifications like, "silly nonsence".

even if you were impatient, they shud have worked with you to get it done properly or let you know that you werent ready and to wait till the job could be done properly. i think its easy enuff for them to just have told you no ... instead of rendering your bass un playable.

but they are a business.
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PostSubject: Re: A couple of Kahlerized basses on eBay   Mon Oct 18, 2010 6:25 am

not that this happened to Martin, but imagine what would the lawsuit would be dollarwise if they ruined his 8,000 Alembic?
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PostSubject: Re: A couple of Kahlerized basses on eBay   Mon Oct 18, 2010 10:27 am

Hah! Good points, guys.

I remember that when I picked it up, Mike himself said he hadn't seen a Kahler come through his shop in like 20 years.
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PostSubject: Re: A couple of Kahlerized basses on eBay   Mon Oct 18, 2010 3:21 pm

i'm not so sure that many would put a kahler on an $8000 alembic ............

i would.

but the point is .......... no one really cares because they are putting it on a $300 bass and thats not worth it to (or you wouldnt be able to) file a suit for $300 worth of dammages? (let alone ... convincing a judge that a kahler was improperly installed)

someone who makes $3 mil a year has a certian value for an $8000 alembic .... probably less value than someone who makes $20K a year puts on a $300 bass.

so this brings back my primitive ways of thinking ... i'll just take the $300 worth out on bashing your stupid face in ... since i have no legal recourse in the realm of $300.

it all just seems easier to me for someone who does builds / installations / repairs to say, "no, i wont install your kahler." or even better, "i dont know how."
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PostSubject: Re: A couple of Kahlerized basses on eBay   Mon Oct 18, 2010 7:23 pm

You Guys all raise some very important points, especially with regards to the attitudes of luthiers who don't want to install a bass trem. If I had a dollar....no....scratch that....if I had a penny for every time I've had some guy tell me the usual "Why would you want to do that?", "It will ruin your bass", They're not very useful", "You'll lose sustain", "Blah-blah-blah", I would be a wealthy dude indeed.

Most of the time, I've let it go at that, except when they've come back with that self-righteous look and/or talk of "you silly fool....you obviously have no idea what you are doing" at which point I immediately unload on them my 26 years of working with bass trems, my board here, and my playing/gigging/recording/teaching experience.

MadMike, it amazes me how much we sound alike!

This is....yet again....for the umpteenth time, another reason why I created this place. We, as bass players, don't get the same level of respect or regard as our guitar brethren, and this is only made worse by using bass trems. We are put into a box, categorized, handed a dog collar and leash, and expected to jump through hoops held by guitarists. The same can be said for the bass players who poo-poo the whole concept as "overdoing it", "playing lead guitar on bass", "frustrated guitar player", and to be totally honest, my middle finger cannot go up fast enough into their faces.

This is, of course, but one issue at hand here. An even more critical one is how many so-called luthiers are out there doing piss-poor work, for which there is no excuse. The fact that this guy ruined your Hamer, Martin, is inexcusable. I could care less how much of a rep he has, and in fact, that makes it even worse, since someone with that kind of ability ought to be able to do good work.

Think about it, Guys. I mean, all of you as bass trem users ought to know that when it comes to installing a bass trem, be it a Kahler or a Hipshot or whatever it happens to be, there is no difference between a bass trem and a guitar trem. Period. You are routing wood according to a certain depth and alignment. What....because it's a bass means that those rules all change??? I think not!

Mike, you made the point about what if it were an $8000 Alembic. I'll add to that by asking, what if it were a $2000 Strat that's receiving a Floyd Rose? A Floyd is infinitely more difficult to install than a Kahler 7410, but it's done properly all the time. When was the last time you heard a guitarist complain that his Floyd was installed crooked? It's as if the guy sees a bass and a bass trem, and he freaks out. Again, there is no excuse!

I feel very fortunate to, not only be playing in a band that actually supports and encourages what I do, but to be with such a guitar whiz like Andy who I know is going to do a perfect job on my basses every single time, no matter what the work may be.

Sorry for the rant, Guys. It's just that I feel overprotective of all of you that have been through this sort of crap, and it really pushes my buttons. Evil or Very Mad

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PostSubject: Re: A couple of Kahlerized basses on eBay   Tue Oct 19, 2010 4:02 am

yep, some of those very same people will say "why did you put a trem on the bass, that's stupid"....but then you see a dozen floydrose tremmed guitars in the background....
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PostSubject: Re: A couple of Kahlerized basses on eBay   Tue Oct 19, 2010 8:37 am

In the time that I haven't been able to play bass, I've been thinking...ruminating about the concept of the "bass guitar" a lot. It's so simple, but still so ambiguous. No matter how many times I try to define it, I'm still left wondering exactly what it is. It's a slippery concept....it can mean anything to anyone. Bass...? Guitar...? Anything in between!! It's such a beautiful creation. I feel overjoyed every day to have taken the time to understand this instrument and to allow myself to express my creativity through it.
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PostSubject: Re: A couple of Kahlerized basses on eBay   Tue Oct 19, 2010 9:05 am

EricHaven wrote:
A Floyd is infinitely more difficult to install than a Kahler 7410, but it's done properly all the time. When was the last time you heard a guitarist complain that his Floyd was installed crooked? It's as if the guy sees a bass and a bass trem, and he freaks out. Again, there is no excuse!

I think you nailed my sentiments there. But instead of kindly asking them about it, I was scared and presumptuous and didn't do anything...except complain, complain, complain to myself. Laughing
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PostSubject: Re: A couple of Kahlerized basses on eBay   Tue Oct 19, 2010 3:18 pm

eric? were you drinking wine again???

ha!

na ... furreal. i run across this with all kindsa bass stuff ... not just trems. it seems to me that if its not for sale on the GC floor, not boutique or not plugging a p bass directly into an ampeg svt and 8X10 and playing with a pick ... its all those responses that eric stated.

i do have a certain beholdeness to everyone here ... so if i come off cross at times ... or just get rude and tell you straight up whats up ... its only because i'm trying to help. honestly, at times, i feel like i could do more for you guys here (but sorry ... i cant buy everyone a new bass Crying or Very sad ).

boots ... i seem to remember you and i having some discussions before about this installation of your kahler?
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PostSubject: Re: A couple of Kahlerized basses on eBay   Tue Oct 19, 2010 4:30 pm

madmike wrote:
plugging a p bass directly into an ampeg svt and 8X10 and playing with a pick
...people do that still ? --eww

madmike wrote:
... i cant buy everyone a new bass Crying or Very sad ).
i'll take a used one then
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PostSubject: Re: A couple of Kahlerized basses on eBay   Tue Oct 19, 2010 6:26 pm

madmike wrote:
eric? were you drinking wine again???

Nah.

Beer. Laughing

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PostSubject: Re: A couple of Kahlerized basses on eBay   Tue Oct 19, 2010 7:46 pm

madmike wrote:
boots ... i seem to remember you and i having some discussions before about this installation of your kahler?

Yeah...too expensive to ship. I'm in no hurry to do it now 'cos I can't play anyway! But thanks, bro! cheers
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PostSubject: Re: A couple of Kahlerized basses on eBay   Tue Oct 19, 2010 8:32 pm

amimbari wrote:
madmike wrote:
plugging a p bass directly into an ampeg svt and 8X10 and playing with a pick
...people do that still ? --eww

If you mean "eww" cos it's downright dirty, then I agree!! haha



It can be a highly effective setup. But I agree that many bassists do not exercise creativity befitting the beauty of the gear. I've never seen a band where the bass guitarist got a sound that gnarly, even using MUCH nicer gear. Except Maiden. Then again, I don't get out much. I did miss Motorhead and Heaven and Hell! Laughing
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PostSubject: Re: A couple of Kahlerized basses on eBay   Wed Oct 20, 2010 3:37 am

thats a cute video with the bass track like that.

I found that video a long time ago on this site, but it still is a youtube video on youtube:
http://www.notreble.com/buzz/2010/09/08/john-entwistle-summertime-blues-live-isolated-bass/

and ya know what...if any of my basses sounded like that and it was the bass not the amp making it sound like that, I would sell it!!! I don't need a 1200.00 Tele to do that...I had plenty of Jap junk that would do it automatically...didn't have to work on that crappy sound --hahaha

nothing but crappy string and fret buzz, with an poorly overdriven early 60's amp...pitiful it made "his" sound so popular...
I like distortion and use my 2 channel rig daily but not like that.
oh wait....I forgot about the flea sound and the flea bass---lol.. N/M. Razz

reminds me of back to the future when martyMcFly turned up the gain on that crappy hollowbody and that 10 watt amp he was using for distortion and his signature quote about dont worry you will like it in the future - or something like that, when everyone stopped dancing and was saying W.T.F.

well I would never-ever want my stuff to sound like the Entwistle early days. Razz tongue
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PostSubject: Re: A couple of Kahlerized basses on eBay   Wed Oct 20, 2010 11:11 am

amimbari wrote:
and ya know what...if any of my basses sounded like that and it was the bass not the amp making it sound like that, I would sell it!!! I don't need a 1200.00 Tele to do that...I had plenty of Jap junk that would do it automatically...didn't have to work on that crappy sound --hahaha

nothing but crappy string and fret buzz, with an poorly overdriven early 60's amp...pitiful it made "his" sound so popular...
I like distortion and use my 2 channel rig daily but not like that.
oh wait....I forgot about the flea sound and the flea bass---lol.. N/M. Razz

reminds me of back to the future when martyMcFly turned up the gain on that crappy hollowbody and that 10 watt amp he was using for distortion and his signature quote about dont worry you will like it in the future - or something like that, when everyone stopped dancing and was saying W.T.F.

well I would never-ever want my stuff to sound like the Entwistle early days. Razz tongue

Hahahaha well played, my friend!! Very Happy

I'll bet it would sound great if you popped enough uppers and were dragged around the world listening to nothing but Keith Moon all night.
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PostSubject: Re: A couple of Kahlerized basses on eBay   Wed Oct 20, 2010 11:27 am

see I can be creative in avoiding a direct answer Smile


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PostSubject: Re: A couple of Kahlerized basses on eBay   Wed Oct 20, 2010 12:00 pm

Players like Arry, Entwistle, Burton...Flea. They're so loved because they could give two shits about technicality. They play from the heart and that's what turns people on. Their playing is riddled with mistakes, but they know and ride their edge and that makes every note so special. There's no excuse for bass guitar to sound boring with people like that to show us the way to true, playful creativity.
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PostSubject: Re: A couple of Kahlerized basses on eBay   Wed Oct 20, 2010 12:28 pm

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PostSubject: Re: A couple of Kahlerized basses on eBay   Thu Oct 21, 2010 10:04 am

amimbari wrote:
here's another kahler bass on ebay you didnt list in the first post:

http://cgi.ebay.com/86-CARVIN-V440-BASS-GUITAR-KAHLER-TREMOLO-/110599908368?pt=Guitar&hash=item19c044ac10

I always wanted one of those, but cash is tight.
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PostSubject: Re: A couple of Kahlerized basses on eBay   Thu Oct 21, 2010 11:16 pm

I totally know what you mean, BD.

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PostSubject: Re: A couple of Kahlerized basses on eBay   Fri Oct 22, 2010 7:45 am

Chowderboots wrote:
Players like Arry, Entwistle, Burton...Flea. They're so loved because they could give two shits about technicality. They play from the heart and that's what turns people on. Their playing is riddled with mistakes, but they know and ride their edge and that makes every note so special. There's no excuse for bass guitar to sound boring with people like that to show us the way to true, playful creativity.

yes ... they do play from the heart ... but i dont agree with the not caring about the technicality ........




http://www.thewho.net/whotabs/gear/bass/bass7485.html

i am constantly looking for enuff gear like this to put together something like a sunn and/or gelf rig. this stuff was so technically advanced for its time ... and for things becoming more technical, i think the tech geeks lost the value of the vintage sound that came from equipment like this. modern ampeg ... yeah right. i mean ... they make some good gear ... but not like this.

the carvin v440.

when i first started playing bass, this is what i wanted. i felt like i would settle for a yamaha BB400 ... but i was 16 years old and i was looking for a birthday or christmas gift. i discovered that i would settle for a hondo jazz bass copy.

i've played BB models and i love em but i've never played a carvin V440. these basses are still getting rave reviews as great instruments but get bummed on because of the unusual body shape ... that just makes me want it more.

i've started looking for one again. this bass was around $700 new in 1986 - 87 ... the only years they produced them (so we know how old it is). this guy can keep his carvin bass for $500 minimum bid of my money. someone will buy it. personally ... i'de give him $300 for it, and i feel like thats being generous. if i bought it, i would need to do some serious refurb work on it ... strip it, new finish, fretjob, new pickups and electronics. at $500 for the bass and what i'de put into it, i'de end up with $1400 invested. amy would kill me! that much invested ... there would be no return on investment if i sold it.

there was some other cat on e bay with a v440 with a kahler on it for $300. it was in pieces and all marked up (like someone lit it on fire or something). poor, poor bass. this guy can keep his junk too.

i found another guy who had a sweet one out in washington for $300. i contacted him last week and he told me he sold it and that it was a cashed web page .... doh!

so the thing that makes me think these have any real value above what they are worth simply as a decent bass is their rarity and limited availability.

there have been multiple posts on the carvin website to start producing these instruments again (including mine). perhaps someday.

i have been talking with justin at JC basses lately about trying to create something like this. he said he's into it and i just gotta scrape up money.

sunn's, vintage carvins, custom basses ... why can't i just hit the lottery?
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PostSubject: Re: A couple of Kahlerized basses on eBay   Fri Oct 22, 2010 8:32 am

Every time I see the Carvin it reminds me of a Washburnl..


.
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PostSubject: Re: A couple of Kahlerized basses on eBay   Fri Oct 22, 2010 9:38 am

madmike wrote:
Chowderboots wrote:
Players like Arry, Entwistle, Burton...Flea. They're so loved because they could give two shits about technicality. They play from the heart and that's what turns people on. Their playing is riddled with mistakes, but they know and ride their edge and that makes every note so special. There's no excuse for bass guitar to sound boring with people like that to show us the way to true, playful creativity.

yes ... they do play from the heart ... but i dont agree with the not caring about the technicality ........




http://www.thewho.net/whotabs/gear/bass/bass7485.html

i am constantly looking for enuff gear like this to put together something like a sunn and/or gelf rig. this stuff was so technically advanced for its time ... and for things becoming more technical, i think the tech geeks lost the value of the vintage sound that came from equipment like this. modern ampeg ... yeah right. i mean ... they make some good gear ... but not like this.

I apologize...that was a total bollocks post from me. What sparked it off was hearing that bass track--Live At Leeds put a bass guitar in my hands--and seeing a quote underneath it in the comments:

"If we stopped a song every time I made a mistake we'd be playing in f*****g morse code."
-John Entwistle

What a Face

Those Marshall, Sunn, HiWatt rigs became classic because the Who were at the cutting edge when they used them first and introduced them to the world in the loudest and most frightening way possible.
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PostSubject: Re: A couple of Kahlerized basses on eBay   Fri Oct 22, 2010 9:40 am

amimbari wrote:
Every time I see the Carvin it reminds me of a Washburnl..


.

Another one of those aftermarket plastic tips!
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PostSubject: Re: A couple of Kahlerized basses on eBay   Fri Oct 22, 2010 8:31 pm

geeze ... i'de sure be happy to take one of those washburns off someones hands too.
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Bass Tremolo Fanatics :: Thoughts and Musings :: General sillyness-
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