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Chowderboots

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PostSubject: Tube Works Real Tube   Mon Apr 20, 2009 11:39 pm

I'm looking for a Tube Works preamp/pedal (preferably the rackmount version). I'm trying to find an auction I think I can win (they pop up a lot on eBay), but if anyone has one and is interested in selling, I'd love to help you out! Very Happy

Here's a great video of how it sounds:



It's an extended layout of my favorite sounding guitar amp, the MosValve combo my friend has. The stacked and clean sounds are just fantastic. So throaty and punchy!!
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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Tue Apr 21, 2009 6:54 pm

Wow! I like the clean, the stacked, and the Tube Screamer tones a lot!

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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Tue Apr 21, 2009 7:37 pm

I know. He isn't pushing it to the extremes it can go to and handle, either. They just sound sick. You hardly have to do anything to get it to work wonderfully...so if anyone sees one or anything, let me know! I'm going to be putting an ad on a couple other forums to see if I can snag one.

It looks like a brutal bidding war on eBay to get one of these and it doesn't surprise me. I wish they still made them. All the GK Butler guitar/bass stuff is just too cool. That's the sound that I cherish...so I'm going to see if I can get one of those. It looks like that preamp is an expanded version of the one in the amp I'm familiar with. Imagining one of those going into the power section on my Mesa Boogie makes me shiver Twisted Evil


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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Tue Apr 21, 2009 7:41 pm

Good luck, Martin! We'll keep our eyes open for one!

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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Tue Apr 21, 2009 7:42 pm

Thanks, man! Cool
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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Thu Apr 23, 2009 9:21 am

is this the rackmount model you want??



http://cgi.ebay.com/Tube-Works-Real-Tube-II-RT-922-2-Channel-Tube-Preamp_W0QQitemZ110377291956QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item110377291956&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66%3A2|65%3A1|39%3A1|240%3A1318|301%3A1|293%3A1|294%3A50


http://cgi.ebay.com/Tube-Works-Blue-Tube-Pre-Amp-w-real-12AX7-Mod-by-Butler_W0QQitemZ290310764725QQcmdZViewItemQQptZGuitar_Amp_Accessories?hash=item290310764725&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66%3A2|65%3A1|39%3A1|240%3A1318|301%3A1|293%3A1|294%3A50


I actually have a Ganiac 1 tube 12ax7 2 channel rackmount that I don't use since I got my Digitech RP.. I'll hook it up, throw a test video on youtube and you can tell me if that is what you like to hear....

UGH "MUSE" distorted bass sounds lol!
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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Thu Apr 23, 2009 2:31 pm

Yes! The RT 922 or 902. They pop up on eBay quite a lot...so I'm going to see if I can snag one next paycheck. Since I just got that Mesa cabinet, as you can imagine, I'm kidna broke. Neutral

But I figured that I might see if I could get one without the eBay struggle.

There's a super clean one up for $125...

http://cgi.ebay.com/Tube-Works-Real-Tube-Preamp-RT-902-Great-Tone_W0QQitemZ110381095011QQihZ001QQcategoryZ10171QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

That's the key to my ideal sound. But I'll have to bite it until I get some money. I would ask someone to get one for me and pay them back, but I don't like to owe people money.

I don't know how that blueface bass pre is, but it's not the same as the guitar pre that has the awesome gain stages...

Sure, man. Thanks! If you want to post up a video clip of what yours can do, I'm curious about how it stacks up against the BK Butler pres.
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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Fri Apr 24, 2009 5:04 am

ya, my point was I'll show you what it does, and if you want it, you can have it for shipping + 20 bucks, cause I NEVER use it anymore, and I might as well GIVE it to someone I know instead of letting it collect dust.
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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Fri Apr 24, 2009 7:01 am

Oh! Well, man...there's an offer I can't refuse, dude! Yeah, please...I'd be willing to give you more than that for that thing, man. How about some electronics and pickups from an '87 Charvel 3B? Laughing
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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Fri Apr 24, 2009 9:59 am

Chowderboots wrote:
Oh! Well, man...there's an offer I can't refuse, dude! Yeah, please...I'd be willing to give you more than that for that thing, man. How about some electronics and pickups from an '87 Charvel 3B? Laughing
this week has been hectic around the house, as you can tell I have not uploaded anything to youtube this week, but I will do the video as a demo of the features and functions of the Ganiac, and post it Saturday.

I will I will......

it's way too late now but DAMN, why didn't you say something when there was 2 TWO pups/preamp sets on ebay that went for under 40 bucks about 2-3 months ago.
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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Fri Apr 24, 2009 10:06 am

Thanks, man! What a Face

Really?? I had no clue about that, man. I want to use totally different pickups in my Charvel...and if I decide to take you up on your offer with the Gainiac, then I'd love to let you have what's in my 3B. It doesn't work the way it should so right now, it's no use to me. But if you want to tinker with it or use it to mod one of your 2Bs, it's all yours!
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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Fri Apr 24, 2009 10:27 am

heres a pic of 3 units I don't use....just in case you say oh-oh-oh what about the behringer compressor/expander, or the washburn EQ/chorus/compressor.

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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Fri Apr 24, 2009 10:42 am

Oh...oh...oh! I have been looking for a rackable chorus unit...and a little compression couldn't hurt either, man. How does the chorus on the Washburn sound? Why don't you use it anymore?

I like the look of the features on the Gainiac...

I'll tell you what, dude. Since I really am bent on having enough dough to get one of those Tube Works 922s in the near future, I would love to take you up on the Rocktron. The Washburn looks like it'd hit the spot as well. So if the chorus/compressor/eq unit isn't going anywhere, after I get an RT 922 or 902, then I'd be more than happy to buy that from you. Sound alright?
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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Fri Apr 24, 2009 11:09 am

I stopped using the Rocktron and Washburn and that Behringer cause I now have the rp50 for EQ/chorus/distortion.... and another Behringer compressor and a Behringer Virtulizer that makes up for the Rocktron and Washburn..

99% of the time I dont use anything.

bass > rp50 > amp. however when the bar/venue needs more than that, I just turn on the other stuff and use the custom presets on them and take the rp50 out of the chain.

not a problem, I can also use the video as a demo for the Washburn at the same time.
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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Fri Apr 24, 2009 12:44 pm

Oh cool. So is the rp50 just more convenient for you (presets/multiple effects?), or do you like its effects better? How does it compare to the Washburn in quality and convenience (not in size, but in how you use/mix effects)? Is there any way to adjust the levels of the individual effects on the WRB-46?

The reason I dig the Washburn is because it makes me think of an Ibanez product from the early 90s...the "Power Trio" floor unit, except the Washburn doesn't look so chintzy. :wink: http://www.ibanez.co.jp/anniversary/expansion.php?cat_id=195&now=1

I always thought it would be cool to have that combination and I like the rackmount unit a lot more. Thanks for enticing me with that Washburn, man! What a Face The only thing that would make it perfect for me (as I would use it mostly for the chorus) would be if it had delay on there as well...but what the hell. It's still pretty damn cool!

Thanks, man! I look forward to hearing how they sound! Cool
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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Fri Apr 24, 2009 1:02 pm

Chowderboots wrote:
Is there any way to adjust the levels of the individual effects on the WRB-46?

look closer at the WRB, each effect has an on off switch, and each effect has a level control....
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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Fri Apr 24, 2009 1:06 pm

Ooh I see the EQ level slider now....hidden, huh? tongue Still don't see the one for the Chorus, but cool!
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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Fri Apr 24, 2009 1:10 pm

the chorus is the "depth" thats the level.

I dont have the pedal anymore for it like this guy does....

http://cgi.ebay.com/1990s-WRB-46-Washburn_W0QQitemZ120408022702QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item120408022702&_trksid=p3286.m20.l1116
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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Fri Apr 24, 2009 1:21 pm

Alright...that makes sense Laughing

I figure that I could make my own footswitch that's a lot sturdier or ad lib something, if I find that I need it. Whenever you get around to making that video, could you please include photos of the backs of the Rocktron and Washburn?
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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Fri Apr 24, 2009 1:26 pm

Chowderboots wrote:
Alright...that makes sense Laughing

I figure that I could make my own footswitch that's a lot sturdier or ad lib something, if I find that I need it. Whenever you get around to making that video, could you please include photos of the backs of the Rocktron and Washburn?
I can do that......
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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Fri Apr 24, 2009 2:09 pm

Cool! Thanks again, man!
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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Fri Apr 24, 2009 5:46 pm

Wow! What a snag! That Gainiac looks awesome!

This is precisely how I'd like to see sales transactions handled here. Thank you for your diplomacy, Guys! Wink

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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Fri Apr 24, 2009 8:05 pm

BTF's first successful sale! cheers

I think that this Gainiac looks a lot cooler than the Gainiac II that they make nowadays. I kinda dig the simplicity of this one. Still next paycheck, I want to have the bread so that when a clean RT922 rolls around, I can snag it. What a Face That's quite literally my dream sound. THE best black metal bass sound and a killer, throaty clean. I can't wait to hear that run in stereo with my 400+ on one side (maybe a little chorused up) and the Tube Works pre smokin' it up on the other side.

The cool thing about the Peavey cabinets I have and the Mesa I'm getting is that you can run a stereo bass into two amps. You can power one or two cabs with each amp. However, if you wanted a slimmed down rig, you could take one cabinet and run two amps into it. I think that's just badass Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Fri Apr 24, 2009 8:29 pm

That is exactly why I want my next rig to be modular. Meaning that I want the components to be separate from one another, so I can build my rig to suit any given situation.

For example, I know that I want an 8x10 and a pair of 1x15's, but I also want to be able to run something like a 1x12 and a 1x15 for smaller venues. My amp will consist of either two preamps and a power amp, or two separate amp heads, but I still haven't completely made up my mind yet.

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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Fri Apr 24, 2009 8:56 pm

I know, dude! You want the wall of deaf? You got it...you want something that will contain all of the smoke and the scope of your sound in one package, you can have that, too.

That's why I'm thinking my dream rig would include a 400+ for one channel (probably the hotter one) with some delay, chorus, whatnot in its effects loop. The other channel would be a Mesa/Boogie Stereo 400 power amp with a Real Tube preamp in front of it. They'd go into various (preferably larger) Mesa cabinets

This way, if I wanted to have each amp run 2 cabs, I could. Or if I wanted each amp to go into the same cab, I could. And if I wanted to transfer the effects from the 400+ to the power amp's other channel and stick something like the Gainiac as a pre in front of it, then have that drive two separate cabs or have each channel go into different parts of one cab, I could do that as well.

Stereo-wired basses are just far too cool...the possibilities, man!! The power! Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Fri Apr 24, 2009 9:44 pm

I can tell you from years of experience that having a stereo rig does open up a whole world of possibilities. When I first learned that this was how Billy Sheehan overcame the issue of how to effectively use distortion on bass, I had no idea just how much it would also work towards producing a superior bass tone overall. It does take some juggling to get used to, but I would never go back now. Once in a while, I find myself in a situation where I have to use a single signal, and to be honest, it cripples me to some extent. You just wind up having more...I dunno...control, I guess? And the tonal range of the bass expands by quite a bit.

For example, Linda and I will go to see some good friends tomorrow night called Blindfate, and I will probably end up jamming a few tunes with them, as they are really great friends of ours. But their bass player plays clean with only a mono signal, and every time I jam on his gear, I find myself doing things that don't read all that well because they are based upon my own personal tone. Oh well! At least it looks like I'm doing something, I guess! Laughing

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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Fri Apr 24, 2009 10:30 pm

I know exactly what you mean. That cheap gear I have was just to see if it might possibly be the right thing for me. Even with such simple, chintzy stuff, the effects just blew me away. I had no clue that I could so simply make a bass sound that was so huge and versatile with such crap gear.

I can sure get by with a mono setup. I have my 400+ running into my Sunn cab right now and it sounds very good for as loud as I can get here...but I can only imagine having another Mesa amp beside it...god damn!! It makes me shiver. I'm getting there.

But man...gear is such a small part of it... Smile
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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Sat Apr 25, 2009 12:03 am

Laughing

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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Sat Apr 25, 2009 5:39 am

sometimes you guys make things way harder than they could be jocolor

I used to want to modify the bass badly to split the output of the 2 pups into 2 amps, but after a lot of consideration, I took the 30 second instant stereo GHETTO version.

here's my recipe:

out of the bass into a y cable to 2 separate channels on my small 6 channel mixer into 2 separate amps and cabs.( one panned left one panned right )

one channel set up for whatever tone/effect out of the mixer, another with another tone/effect both channels panned left and right the phaseshift and chorus is now stereo and will sweep back and forth thanks to the mixer, and the pups although both running, can be set to whatever tone you want thru the mixer for each amp/cab you have on it....

GHETTO STEREO lol!
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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Sat Apr 25, 2009 9:17 am

Hah!! Laughing

Yeah...that sounds like fun...but why have it be simple and tidy like that when you can make it involved as hell?? What a Face
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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Sat Apr 25, 2009 12:56 pm

Yeah, it is a more complex way of doing things, I will admit! Laughing But for me personally, it's about yielding the results I want. Now the way you've designed your split Mike is something I've done before, and for most folks it will work just fine. But the problem I've run into goes back to the source. Let me explain.

It is true that you can split a single pickup output into a Y cable to run two signals, but you have to remember that you are now dividing the power output of the pickup in two. So if your pickup will normally produce something like 170mv running at 12k ohms, now you are running two signals that are each being fed with only 85mv at 6k ohms apiece. This means that the mixer channels now only receive half of the pickups potential. So you say "well, that's what the mixer gain control is for. To compensate for the lowered output." But what the mixer is amplifying is still only half of the pickups output, meaning that you are only making a stripped-down signal louder. No big deal? Perhaps. But what you may not realize is that, in splitting the pickups output, you have also now cut its harmonic content in half. The result is that you lose reading ability and sensitivity of the pickup, which further results in loss of gain, harmonics, and tonal range. And since I do things like pull feedback and harmonics, I need to have the full range of the pickup's output to get those results.

This is how your garden-variety bass overdrive/distortion pedal works. It takes the incoming signal, and splits it into two paths. One remains clean, the other goes through the dirt, then it re-combines the signal. For simply producing an overdrive tone, it will work fine. But it absolutely sucks for feedback and harmonics because the gain simply isn't there anymore. Trust me on this one. I have tried more ways to Sunday to get the same results using one output, and running two outputs beats the living crap outta the mono version hands-down.

For many players, these things might not be an issue, and that's fine. It is true that splitting off one pickup will work, just that it doesn't work for me. I only know from years of experiments that I need to have the full level of output from the pickup in order to get the results I want.

So for me, running two separate outs from the bass into two amps is a small price to pay. Cool

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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Sat Apr 25, 2009 8:48 pm

I didn't know that splitting the signal in two sacrifices the quality of the sound like that...it makes me like the direction I'm going even more. I think that the organic sound of an un-obfuscated signal path is what I crave.
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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Sun Apr 26, 2009 5:42 am

ya Eric, that's the scientific explanation...mine's the GHETTO do it in the bar version since my effect loop thru the little mixer I use is stereo, and if I pan the 2 channels, and hit the phaseshift or chorus sweep, it does go left to right, but no, the pickups are still blending the "same" tone into each channel.. Yes for true stereo 1 pickup per channel, your way (that way) is the only way---
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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Sun Apr 26, 2009 9:33 am

That's a cool way of going about it. I considered getting one of those stereo chorus pedals or something before I learned about wiring a bass itself in stereo. Using a splitter still sounds like it'd be fun...but not really, you know?
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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Sun Apr 26, 2009 2:01 pm

Oh believe me, I'm all for the GHETTO versions of accomplishing things! Laughing I've done more than my share in my own situations plenty of times! Wink

But at the point I'm at now, I know what it is I want to achieve, and I know exactly what I have to do to achieve it. And for me, that can only be done by using two separate signals from the bass. And not only does this give me the results I want, I actually enjoy doing it. Sometimes just seeing the reactions from people when they see two cords wrapped together coming out of the bass is enough. Inevitably, I get a few people that ask me things like "so...what exactly is going on there?" because it does look more dramatic.

Way back when I first started running two signals, my Dad (who was easily my biggest fan, God rest his soul) suggested that I use a stereo microphone cable to run the two signals with. His thought was that this would achieve the same splitting mode, but while only having one cord coming from the bass. I considered it, but I soon realized that I actually liked having the appearance of two cords. Why? Ok...this is going to sound really grandiose of me, and I honestly don't mean for it to, so forgive me. But I like it because it draws attention. People notice there's something different going on. And after all, why is it that we get up in front of people to begin with? Is it to just become wallflowers? Nooo! It's to get and hold the attention of the audience you are working to entertain.

Several years ago while I was still living down in San Jose, CA, I walked into a music store to purchase a new arm for my Kahler (I had lost it during a gig), and the guy behind the counter who I had never met before recognized me. He said "you're that Sheehan-type guy with the umbilical cord running from your bass, right?" Laughing

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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Sun Apr 26, 2009 11:43 pm

I dig the flashiness of the extra cable all the way, man. You can even get extravagant and use a red one for the hot and a black one for the other channel...which I believe you already do. Make a pretty loom out of it...bam! Need to do that, but I HATE buyin instrument cables. Such a scam. For a cable that doesn't look like chintz, $60? No way! It seems like such extremes...$60 or more or $10 for a POS. I want to just make my own sometimes. But not really. Would be cheaper.

Thing is, I like the molded connector housings because of how burly they are, but I think that most of the ones that are affordable look like cack. I guess it doesn't matter. Nothing appeals to meas far as cables, but I need something to send a fuggin' signal through, you know? hahahaha

scratch
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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Mon Apr 27, 2009 7:26 pm

You're right, Martin. I do use a red cable for my distortion channel, and a black cable for my clean channel.

One of these days when I can afford to do so, I am going to go wireless. This, of course, raises another challenge in as much as I need two units to do my thing. And since I want really superior digital UHF wireless units, it'll set me back by quite a little bit. One of these days! Wink

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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Mon Apr 27, 2009 8:14 pm

Oi yeah man those things are pricey...but they're so cool! afro

http://www.shure.com/ProAudio/Products/WirelessMicrophones/us_pro_SLX_content

At our theatre, we have six of the SLX body packs and all kinds of the wireless mics (58s, 87s, and a bunch of Lavaliers). I believe my mom has one of the Lavalier models as well. They're great systems, man. They're burly and really reliable. The weakest link is the cable that runs between the mic/output jack and the body pack. But yeah, they are expensive. The instrument SLX system is $560 when it's all said and done...but damn that'd be fun! What a Face
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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Mon Apr 27, 2009 9:06 pm

I just know that I don't want my signal degraded one bit by an inferior wireless system. I want my smoke! Laughing

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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Mon Apr 27, 2009 9:50 pm

Shouldn't have a problem with that with Shure What a Face Those things are top-notch! But I'd definitely shop around.
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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Tue Apr 28, 2009 8:23 pm

Will do. Once I'm ready to actually buy, I am going to do a lot of research, and ask a lot of questions before deciding which brand I'll purchase.

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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Tue Apr 28, 2009 8:40 pm

Didn't doubt ya for a second! Laughing
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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Wed Apr 29, 2009 9:26 am

with all the work garbage, and other stuff this week, I FINALLY created a video for the demo on the Ganiac, and Washburn units Martin. I will get it posted on youtube this weekend at the latest, and then you can see what it does...the funny thing was I actually used the Ganiac clean channel last night for our practice since I pulled it out of the rack to plug it in for the video....hahaha I don't even think anyone knew I was running it and not my little mixer for EQ control...

couple more days sir, and you shall have your demo for sure...........
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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Wed Apr 29, 2009 3:29 pm

Thanks a million, Mike! Very Happy

Huh. That's good to hear. I'm looking forward to having a couple effects units to spice things up a bit!
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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Sat May 16, 2009 12:23 am

Amimbari--I'm still interested in the Gainiac, if you are still interested in selling it! What a Face
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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Sat May 16, 2009 5:41 am

Chowderboots wrote:
Amimbari--I'm still interested in the Gainiac, if you are still interested in selling it! What a Face
oh my, I forgot about that email me this weekend so I can get your address--oops.
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PostSubject: Re: Tube Works Real Tube   Sat May 16, 2009 10:50 am

No problemo, I'll do that. Do you have a video of the unit's features? I'd still like to see it, just to see how it compares to the sounds I've heard from similar devices.
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